A Touch of Sin （天注定）

For more info: http://www.middlebury.edu/academics/fmmc/hirschfield#touch

interview with Jia Zhangke, parts 1 and 2

Q. and A.: Jia Zhangke on Violence, Censorship and His New Film “A Touch

of Sin”

By EDWARD WONG

 

One afternoon, as a late summer thunderstorm rolled into Beijing, a small

group of Chinese and foreign journalists sat in the Beijing office of Jia

Zhangke, the Chinese director, watching his latest film, “A Touch of Sin.”

Mr. Jia had finished one round of appearances at film festivals and was in

Beijing for a spell, before heading to festivals in the fall in Toronto;

New York; San Sebastián, Spain; and elsewhere. The film had made its world

premiere at the Cannes Film Festival in May, where it won a best

screenplay award.

 

Mr. Jia’s office is in a gray apartment block in northwest Beijing, and it

is here that he writes scripts, talks to producers and edits his films.

Mr. Jia’s awards, including the Golden Lion from the Venice Film Festival,

sit in a cheap trophy case in the main room. The walls of the rooms are

decorated with framed posters of Mr. Jia’s films from various countries.

The most striking is a French one for “Platform” that, in its original

form, showed Mao Zedong’s face upside down. Mr. Jia has reversed it so

that Mao is right-side up and has hung it in a back room above the

computer and monitors he uses for editing.

 

Dressed in a black T-shirt, Mr. Jia served us tea as we waited for

everyone to gather. There was some small talk about his home province of

Shanxi, a dusty coal region in northern China, and then he turned off the

lights. The opening scenes of “A Touch of Sin” began unfolding on a

wide-screen television. We could hear thunder outside, but that did not

distract from the viewing. Afterward, Mr. Jia sat down with us for

one-on-one interviews in Chinese.

 

I wrote a profile

<http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/14/world/asia/filmmaker-giving-voice-to-act

s-of-rage-in-todays-china.html> of Mr. Jia based on that visit, but could

only incorporate some of his comments because of space constraints. The

entire hourlong interview gives greater insight into Mr. Jia’s working

process and the challenges of filmmaking in China. The following is a

transcript of that interview, translated by my colleague Amy Qin, with a

few parenthetical notes for clarification. The second half will be posted

Monday.

 

Q. You’ve said before that “A Touch of Sin” is your take on a martial arts

film. Why did you decide to make a kind of martial arts film based on

contemporary news events?

 

A. Actually I had been preparing to make a martial arts film since 2007, a

real martial arts film. It doesn’t have an English title yet. In Chinese

it’s called “In the Qing Dynasty” (在清朝). It deals with the period from

1895 to 1905. The reason I wanted to film this period is because this is

when China’s transformation began. And that transformation has continued

up to now. It hasn’t stopped.

 

Last year, while I was still in the process of preparing for the film —

well, not just last year, more like two or three years ago — I started

using Weibo, and Chinese society also became more interested in using

Weibo, China’s Twitter. It’s had a big impact on the lives of Chinese

people.

 

The biggest impact I think is that now if something happens, no matter

where it is in China, it can be seen by people immediately. And I feel

that the way I understand China’s reality has also changed, because now I

can see these things that are happening all around China on Weibo.

Different kinds of things, not just these ones in the film. There are good

stories and there are bad stories. But for me, I slowly began to see the

problem of individual violence in society. There are many tragedies or

social problems in which people ultimately rebel, and this becomes a very

big tragedy. So I began to pay more and more attention to this problem

because, frankly speaking, I feel that the Chinese people really don’t

understand the problem of violence because society has never had a

widespread discussion of the problem.

 

Especially in films, violence used to be restricted. Of course, there are

two aspects of this. One is the censorship of films. In the past they

didn’t really allow too much violence in movies, especially when the

violence was closely interrelated with society. Then there is the cultural

convention in China where we are not very willing to look back on or

confront unpleasant events. Obviously, all of these violent events are

unpleasant. But for me, it is not enough for the news media to report on

these violent incidents. I think what films can do is provide an emotional

understanding, and in the one or two hours of a film we can try to

understand these incidents. From that time on, I really wanted to direct

this kind of movie.

 

But I didn’t immediately think of a good way to make this movie. Because

for a director, aside from the content, what is the most effective

cinematic language to use to tell the story? I didn’t know right away. But

it happened that one day, while I was preparing for the martial arts film,

I suddenly knew what I wanted to do. I knew I wanted to make a movie about

these four stories. I thought these four stories were just like the

martial arts films made in the past except that they were set in

contemporary China. So I thought I could use a traditional martial arts

style to film the movie I wanted to make about today’s China. Once I

decided this, I began preparations for it in August last year. Production

took a very long time. Because starting in August, when we began

pre-production, to filming — first we were in Guangdong Province, in

Dongguan, for about three weeks. Then we went to Chongqing, and we were

there for about another three weeks. Then we went to Shennongjia in Hubei

to film the third story. And then we went to Shanxi Province, where we

finished filming. We began filming at the end of last October and

continued into March, so it was five months in all.

 

You could say this was the most complicated of my films to make. Often

when we were chatting, we’d say that it was like filming four separate

movies, because these four stories are very different from each other. For

each of them, the production and the pre-production had to be completely

redone. So really we used the energy for making four movies to finish this

one movie.

 

Q. Did you intend to make a film that was widely representative of China,

both geographically and in terms of characters?

 

A. Yes, I had thought why didn’t I just film one of these stories, since

each one could be made into a separate film? There were really two

reasons. The most important is that we don’t experience life by

encountering just one person or one event. Rather, we encounter lots of

information and many people at the same time. I wanted to convey this

experience through multiple stories, the experience of exchanging

information back and forth on the Internet. Another reason is that each

story is really a very extreme one, because violence is itself extreme. An

extreme story is not necessarily something that happens all the time. So

it often gives the impression of being an isolated case, and it might seem

like this person was simply in very particular circumstances that led to

this tragedy.

 

But what we see in China today is that these kind of events happen all the

time. They are no longer rare events. There are profound social reasons

why they occur. So I feel that by using multiple stories we are telling

people that this isn’t necessarily an exception, nor is this an isolated

and extreme story. That these kind of stories happen in China all the time.

 

For example, after I returned from Cannes, there was very unfortunate

news. There was an explosion in a bus in Fujian, then the gun rampage at a

Shanghai factory, and then the Beijing airport explosion. There have been

many commentaries that have said “A Touch of Sin” is a kind of prophetic

piece. But it’s not really prophetic. I wasn’t predicting anything.

Rather, I saw circumstances in present-day Chinese society that make us

feel rather uneasy. Through the film, I hope to raise people’s awareness

as well as present my own impression of these circumstances. So these four

characters don’t necessarily represent individual cases so much as

something we should recognize as a social problem.

 

Another thing is — there are so many stories out there, so why did I

choose these four? For this, I had to consider the language of my film. I

always knew I wanted to make a film that would sum up China’s condition.

It’s like what ancient Chinese painters said, “to depict all of China in

one painting” (万里河山图). I thought if I had a chance to make a film about

China, representing its circumstances from north to south, then I would do

it. It just so happened that the first story takes place in northern

China, in Shanxi. The second story is in the southwest, in Chongqing. The

third story is in central China, in Hubei. And the last story is in the

southern province of Guangdong, in Dongguan.

 

Aside from visual considerations, I feel it also addresses the mobility of

Chinese people, those looking for life opportunities by moving. This is

especially true of the young man from the interior going to Guangdong for

temporary work and trying to change his life. In the process of moving,

they are always hoping to find opportunities. But movement on this large a

scale also highlights a big issue, which is the enormous geographic

disparity of China. China’s resources are concentrated in the eastern

developed regions and in the big cities, so people move to Shanghai,

Beijing and Guangzhou. This has its own social problems. So I wanted to

make a film that wasn’t just about one person and wasn’t in just one

place. Rather, it would demonstrate China’s situation through this

movement.

 

Q. The protagonists in martial arts films are typically considered heroes.

Do you see the characters in your film as heroes?

 

A. From the perspective of individual dignity, I personally really admire

them. I particularly feel this about the third story, the story of the

woman. After she has been so abused, she chooses to fight back. I think,

from this point of view, it’s the same as with characters in traditional

martial arts films. But the circumstances of these four people are all

very different. They represent different kinds of violent problems.

Generally speaking, the conclusion of each story is tragic. To me,

violence is not necessarily the best response to violence. It’s not a

method I identify with. But it is a way out. So to a certain extent, I can

certainly understand them [the protagonists]. But that doesn’t necessarily

mean that I approve of their actions.

 

Q. In the United States, when this kind of film is released, there is

often a public discussion about whether violence in films might encourage

people to use violence in real life. Do you think this film will start the

same kind of discussion in China?

 

A. Actually, that is not one of my hopes for this movie. I don’t want this

film to inspire imitation or to convince people that violence is good. I

trust that the power of this film lies in its ability to encourage people

to think about violence, to reflect on it. I think the destructiveness of

violence is made clear in the film. Violence is extremely destructive. I

also hope that the audience will understand these characters as I do and

not identify with their methods.

 

Q. What are the reasons for these fundamental social problems?

 

A. I think the biggest problem is that [economic] reform has given rise to

many problems. These problems need to be solved as soon as possible. Chief

among them are the problem of social inequality and problems such as

distribution of income. I feel that inequality is the basis of all of

these. It includes the restrictions on young people as they are trying to

get ahead. I think we must use reform to solve these problems.

 

Q. Do you think that the people who go to Dongguan to work feel like they

can change their lives, or do you think that after they have been there

for a few months they want to give up?

 

A. I feel that most of the people I’ve met, such as the young people in

Dongguan, when they first go to the south, to Dongguan, they’re full of

hope and longing to change their lives. They have many dreams. But once

they start to do the repetitive work and they start to really see what

life is like, and as they become part of the manufacturing industry and

get to know the city, they slowly begin to feel more and more despair.

This despair is due to their income, their work, or maybe they feel

oppressed by all this movement, and so lose hope. This hopelessness

depresses their spirit. The reason so many of these kids jump off

buildings has a lot to do with losing hope.

 

Q. Do you think that your film is a sort of critique of capitalism?

 

A. I feel that China is not necessarily capitalist. I think the problem

has more to do with influential officials taking resources for themselves.

I remember [Prime Minister] Li Keqiang talking this year about what needs

to be done in order to end these interest-driven restraints on China’s

development. I feel Li Keqiang said it very clearly. So to me, it’s not

necessarily about communism versus capitalism, as much as it is a problem

of a monopoly by powerful officials.

 

Q. In the film, we see everything from the point of view of the workers.

Do you think there should be any sympathy for the other people in the

system?

 

A. Well, first, it’s not really possible to show too many different points

of view in a movie. For me, my own perspective is the perspective that I

have now, my own situation. Of course, the reason this film ends with the

faces of all these people is that I think it is very difficult to blame

China’s problems on a single class or a single group, even if it’s as

simple as blaming the system or blaming powerful officials. I feel that

the current social circumstances developed from everything together,

including cultural problems. So, for example, in the film we didn’t

describe these [wealthier] people too much. They might also have their own

pressures. I think it’s very difficult to place blame on one person or

class. I think everyone should take responsibility. That includes, I

think, being silent, not speaking out, taking the side of the evil-doer.

 

Q. Your first few films were about Shanxi, your home province, then you

began to film more about other parts of China. What brought about this

change?

 

A. I think it has to do with how I myself have changed. When I first began

to make movies, they dealt more directly with my life and my own feelings.

So I made a lot of movies about Shanxi in the beginning because I grew up

in Shanxi, I felt it was part of me. I used it as a very simple expression

of my feelings. The movie “Platform” is also an observation of the 1980s,

but I didn’t really do much from the perspective of history or economics

or society to understand life. But in the last few years, because of the

speed of China’s transformation, I have become very interested in history.

So I’ve started to acquire a historical perspective about certain things,

and I’ve also become interested in China’s social problems, its economic

problems, its political problems. So I feel now that with “A Touch of

Sin,” it’s not just an issue of individual emotions, but also an

expression of the state of the entire nation. I think in filming these

past few years, I’ve also looked at things from an aesthetic perspective,

because as a director, you have to have aesthetic considerations. But at

the same time, I feel I’ve acquired a social perspective and a historical

perspective.

 

Q. Both “Unknown Pleasures” and “A Touch of Sin” have scenes of bank

robberies, yet they feel very different, and they seem to me to represent

the contrasts between your older work and this film. Can you compare them?

 

A. In “Unknown Pleasures,” when the young man goes to rob the bank, it’s

quite amateurish. He’s acting on impulse, taking a sudden action because

he’s unhappy. In “A Touch of Sin,” it’s professional, the man is a

professional criminal. Being a professional criminal represents his

understanding of society. He might think that the stuff he steals should

be his. He has less of a sense of having committed a crime, less of a

negative feeling.

 

Q. Why didn’t the censors think this film was very sensitive?

 

A. First, I think the stories in my film are stories that can no longer be

suppressed. We might have seen these stories on Weibo, and then in

unofficial media, because we all see unofficial media. And even official

media are covering these stories. So these stories are a part of a record

that cannot be erased. It’s a record of reality. The news forms a backdrop

for film. Everyone knows about it, everyone in the media is talking about

it, so there is probably less pressure than before as to whether a film

can address these issues.

 

Q. How did you respond to the requests from the censors?

 

A. During the censorship process, they said they were more concerned about

certain bits of dialogue, which I felt didn’t have a huge impact on the

film. But they also made suggestions about taking out some of the more

violent scenes. They didn’t say I had to take it out; they were just

suggesting I do that. I didn’t want to change it, so I explained my own

view. I feel that in a film that’s intended to be a reflection on

violence, if we don’t see the destructiveness of violence, then I don’t

really know what I should be discussing.

 

For example, if our culture had permitted us to talk about violence and to

confront it over the past 30 years or even 20 years or 10 years, then,

given my personality, it would have been possible for me to make a very

measured, very restrained film, a film that doesn’t have these kinds of

scenes. But in the cultural environment of Chinese films, aside from

commercial films with violent scenes, there are no films that confront

violence as an issue. So when I made this film, I felt I had to depict the

violence. I shouldn’t avoid it.

 

To be continued in Part Two, in which Jia Zhangke discusses the evolution

of the censorship process, industry financing and the need for films to

reflect everyday life in China.

 

 

=================================================

 

From: Ian Johnson ()

Subject: Jia Zhangke interview 2

 

Source: Sinophere Blog, NYT (10/21/13):

http://sinosphere.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/10/20/q-a-jia-zhangke-on-his-new-f

ilm-a-touch-of-sin-part-2/

 

Q. and A.: Jia Zhangke on His New Film ‘A Touch of Sin,’ Part 2

By EDWARD WONG

 

In the second part of my interview with the Chinese director Jia Zhangke,

he discusses censorship, industry financing and the need for films to

reflect everyday life in China.

 

Q. What kinds of changes to the censorship process have taken place in the

last 10 or 15 years?

 

A. The censorship process has changed a lot. I think the biggest change

happened in 2004. After 2004, from my own perspective, from the

perspective of someone who works in the film industry, there was more

discussion in the censorship process. In the past, no one came to talk to

us. They would just say “yes” or “no.” No one would listen to the

director, no one talked to the director about why he or she made the film

or why he or she dealt with the subject in this manner. After 2004,

directors began to have the opportunity to discuss and express their own

views. After 2004, the range of subjects that directors could make films

about also expanded. Of course, it’s not at the point we’d like. But I’ve

always believed that we must encourage progress of China’s system. If

China makes progress, then we must recognize it. The censorship process

has slowly become more relaxed.

 

At the same time, we can’t forget the power of China’s cultural

conservatism. It’s not official, it doesn’t come from the government. It

comes from the people. For example, “Django Unchained” by Quentin

Tarantino. “Django Unchained” was initially approved. It played for one

night and then it was halted because there’s a scene in the movie with a

naked man. Why did this happen? Because there were some conservative

people in the audience who wrote letters and made phone calls to report

it. So if we’re looking at what’s blocking the progress of Chinese

society, we can’t just look at official controls. It also has to do with

the Chinese people themselves.

 

Q. Why do you say these changes took place starting in 2004?

 

A. In 2004, there was a change in that China wanted to develop its film

industry. It became more commercialized. The change was very big, because

they began to look at films as an industry. Before, films were seen as

propaganda tools, just like CCTV or People’s Daily. After 2004, in order

to build up the Chinese film industry, officials began to see films not as

simply propaganda but as an industry. This change in thinking directly led

to the relaxation in policies that came about later.

 

Q. Are there political pressures put on you in certain aspects of your

work, such as what happened with the Melbourne International Film Festival

[Mr. Jia withdrew a film of his from the festival because a documentary

about Rebiya Kadeer, the ethnic Uighur dissident living in the United

States, was also scheduled to be shown at the festival. In July 2009,

Uighurs rioted in the capital of the western Chinese region of Xinjiang,

resulting in many deaths. Mr. Jia’s friend Zhao Liang also withdrew a film

from the festival, and said in an interview with The New York Times in

2011 that Chinese film bureau officials had pressured him and Mr. Jia to

do so.]

 

A. I think this is a misunderstanding. In 2009, it was my own personal

decision. I made the decision because I felt that the film festival had

become a thing where directors were forced to express their opinions on

certain political systems. Whether you went or didn’t — either way you

were making a political statement. I didn’t like this feeling. I’m a

director. I don’t want to go to a film festival and have people think that

I’m trying to make a political statement. Furthermore, that year I saw the

violence in Xinjiang and I felt very sad about it. It was violence between

people, and between ethnic groups, between the Han people and the Uighurs.

I was very saddened by it.

 

Q. Were there any officials who said that you shouldn’t show your film at

the film festival?

 

A. No.

 

Q. So you’re saying officials didn’t pressure you and political

considerations didn’t influence your decision at all?

 

A. No, this sort of thing has never happened. The only time I come into

contact with the government is when a film is going through the review

process.

 

Q. Has the commercialization of the film industry in China had an impact

on the way you make films?

 

A. It hasn’t affected me very much, because I’m pretty clear about what

kind of films I like and the kinds of problems I’ll encounter in making

such films. For example, with these kinds of films — whenever the film is

passed on to the censors, I always feel anxious, whereas commercial films

usually don’t have a problem. I understand these circumstances. And these

kinds of films are usually not celebrated by the Chinese market. This I

know very well and I understand it. So it doesn’t have a big impact on me.

 

Q. If you want to continue to make these kinds of movies, how do you find

investment?

 

A. This is actually something I don’t really worry about because all of my

films have made money for the investors.

 

Q. I saw that “A Touch of Sin” has different investors. From China, there

are Shanghai Film Group and Shanxi Film & Television Group. And there’s

Office Kitano from Japan. Is most of the money from domestic groups?

 

A. Starting from 2004, it’s been mostly domestic and foreign money

combined. Sometimes there is Japan or France or South Korea.

 

Q. In the United States, growing commercialization has had a big impact on

the film industry. Is this the same in China?

 

A. In China, it’s pretty much the same. It’s had a big influence. On one

hand, you’re faced with the continuing decline in the average age of

filmgoers. This year, in China, the average age of moviegoers was 21, and

it continues to drop. So the market is starting to make movies aimed at

this younger age group.

 

At the same time, the cinema system in China is not very sophisticated.

The biggest impact has been on independent films or art-house films.

There’s less and less room for these films in theaters.

 

Q. So if a director in China wants to make an independent film, how does

he or she go about finding investment or people to back him?

 

A. The best thing is to find people to support you. Finding people to

support you depends on finding people who want to support this art, not

necessarily because they want to make a profit with this film. China’s

rapid economic development has in fact given rise to these kinds of

investors, these kinds of bosses, who might take this approach to make

this kind of movie.

 

Q. So do you think you might make a commercial film in the future?

 

A. I wouldn’t say no to the opportunity. Take this martial arts film that

I am preparing for now. For Chinese audiences, martial arts films are

commercial films. Maybe if I brought it to America it would be considered

an art-house film. But in China it’s a commercial film. I do have an

interest in making films that ordinary audiences want to watch, and at the

same time trying to communicate my own thinking and philosophy to the

21-year-old film-going audience.

 

This film is currently in pre-production. I hope to begin filming by next

year, after the Lunar New Year, because the pre-production is basically

finished. It’s just because we decided to film “A Touch of Sin” in the

middle that it was halted.

 

Q. Why did you want to make this kind of a martial arts film?

 

A. It has to do with my own study of history. I was born in 1970, and in

1979, when China began opening up, I was 9. So my entire childhood and

adolescence coincided with China’s reform and opening. So for a long time,

I had this idea that China’s transformation began in 1979.

 

But later, when I started reading a lot about history, I began to realize

that China’s biggest transformation actually started in 1895, or toward

the end of the Qing Dynasty. That transformation was actually a huge

change because before, China didn’t have science. All of a sudden,

mathematics, astronomy and geography were introduced. And China used to be

a central empire, and then all of a sudden you have America and France. So

China’s real efforts to become modern began back then — including how

people dressed, what they ate, their education.

 

So my story is about education. You know the civil service examination

system. In 1905 or so it was abolished because China wanted to catch up

with modern science. But many people had undergone this education [in the

Confucian classics in preparation for the examination], and all of a

sudden the system was abolished. They had no way to make a living. So I

saw what this transformation was for many people — a sort of passive

sacrifice. It was very passive. Because of the transformation, the

individual was sacrificed. I’m obsessed with this period, because it’s

just like ours. But I wanted to use martial arts to talk about this time.

 

Q. Are there other genre forms with which you want to work later?

 

A. I’m preparing to make a spy movie after this martial arts film. It’s

set from 1949 to 1966, the start of the Cultural Revolution. It’s a spy

story that takes place in Hong Kong. The history and the relationship

between the Kuomintang and the Communist Party is something that Chinese

people need to think about.

 

Q. Is it important to you to make an epic historical film? It seems to me

that all Chinese filmmakers want to make one.

 

A. I think that Chinese directors have a very strong interest in Chinese

history. This derives from the fact that so much of the truth about

Chinese history has been suppressed. A lot of directors want to film a

truthful version of Chinese history. Just as I want to make a 1949 spy

movie — because I want to portray what the relationship between the

Kuomintang and the Communist Party was really like. It’s an interest in

the truth.

 

For example, the history around the War of Resistance [against Japan] — in

the War of Resistance, during World War II, the Kuomintang actually played

a major role and made many sacrifices. But after 1949 — ever since I was

little, I have been taught that the Kuomintang forces didn’t actually

resist, that they tried to escape. Once we understand what really

happened, then we begin to want to express it. Because I find that the

history we were studying was problematic. From a professional perspective,

of course, we want to film it.

 

Q. You traveled to two film festivals with “A Touch of Sin”?

 

A. I went to Cannes and Melbourne.

 

Q. What was the reaction to the film among foreigners?

 

A. I think that, for the most part, at both Cannes and Melbourne,

foreigners could understand the stories in the film. They also had

questions, such as, well, the same here — is it necessary to have such

violent scenes? Many people asked this, and I just told them that I think

that if you want to understand violence, to understand the destructiveness

of violence, then I don’t know how else to do it. I also think that

foreigners have a general understanding of China, such as what’s going on

there politically or economically. Their sense as a whole is pretty good,

so they can understand the stories from afar, from the perspective of

China’s development. Normally Chinese viewers will understand the movie

through individual perspectives, from the perspectives of the characters.

 

Q. There are some people here who criticize the foreign media for paying

too much attention to the darker aspects of China. Have you gotten this

kind of criticism?

 

A. From my first film “Xiao Wu” to now, I’ve heard this kind of criticism.

In the past, I might have responded to it, but now I don’t really respond

because it’s very obvious. From my perspective, what I am most interested

in is individual destinies, and within individual destinies what I’m most

interested in is individual struggles. I think this is a general interest

that has existed among artists since the beginning of art and movies. We

will always be concerned with these struggles, we will always look at the

weaknesses, we will always feel a great impulse to understand these dark

situations. This is something that doesn’t need to be explained.

 

Through our portrayal of dark situations, through our description of

unfortunate events, what we get is a sort of life experience and an

affirmation of life. I remember there was an artist who said that on

reading Lu Xun’s short stories, he realized that Lu Xun’s short stories

are all very dark, but they are like a match that illuminates us. This is

art. Otherwise, what do we film? There is no shortage of these kinds of

films.

 

Q. What was the budget on “A Touch of Sin”?

 

A. The budget on the film was about $4 million. It was the most expensive

of all the films I’ve made. Two-thirds of the investment was from domestic

companies — from the film groups in Shanghai and Shanxi, as well as my own

production company, Xstream Pictures.

 

Q. Which Chinese filmmakers do you follow?

 

A. From Taiwan, I follow Hou Hsiao-Hsien and Tsai Ming-liang’s work. From

Hong Kong, Johnnie To and Wong Kar-wai. From the mainland, Lou Ye, Wang

Xiaoshuai — basically these are the directors who are the same age as I am.

 

Q. What about younger directors on the mainland?

 

A. Han Jie or Hao Jie and Wang Bing.

 

Q. You often edit your own films. Did you do that with “A Touch of Sin”?

 

A. I edited “A Touch of Sin” in Datong. Because work was too chaotic here,

I went to Datong and I stayed in a hotel. For seven or eight days I didn’t

go downstairs, I just kept to myself. To eat I would go down to the second

floor and then I would go back up and continue editing. I edit my films

myself. I also write the films myself. I handwrote this one. It’s faster

than using a computer. I edited all my films except “24 City.” That one I

wrote with Zhai Yongming. This time writing by hand was faster than

writing with a computer. This time I really wanted to write it by hand,

and I also wrote it really fast. And I have this colleague from school —

no matter how messy my handwriting was, he could read it and then would

type it out. This handwritten screenplay will be published in China, maybe

in one or two years, by a publishing house in Shandong.

 

Q. You’ll be at the New York Film Festival at the end of September. Are

you looking forward to it?

 

A. It has a big Chinatown, and I’m looking forward to going there. The

first thing is always to find a Chinatown. Then you can have a great

Chinese meal. [laughs]

 

—–

 

After the screening of “A Touch of Sin” and before Jia Zhangke did

one-on-one interviews, he engaged for about 20 minutes in a free-flowing

conversation with the journalists he had invited to his office. Here are a

few interesting comments he made during that discussion.

 

Q. What were some of the most interesting reactions to the film at

festival showings?

 

A. The most interesting reaction was that the audience would applaud when

people got killed. But when the horse was being beaten or being yelled at,

people would feel the pain. A lot of people couldn’t stand watching the

horse getting beaten or yelled at, but could tolerate the killing of

people.

 

Q. At the international film festivals you attended [Cannes and Melbourne,

at this point], what were the differences in reactions between overseas

Chinese and foreigners?

 

A. Overseas Chinese understand the background of the film better. A lot of

people know the stories you’re depicting. Overseas Chinese seem to be

really concerned about whether or not this film can be released in China.

Everyone has been asking me about it, and I keep telling everyone this

film has already been approved. No one believes me.

 

After the film was submitted to the censors, we waited 20 days, and they

came back with two pages of orders and suggestions. The screenplay had

already been approved before that. There weren’t really any problems with

the script. The two pages were for the finished film. I felt like it

wasn’t too bad. They are trying to change as well.

 

They waited two to three weeks after the first edit was submitted to the

censorship board, and then they came back with the two pages. And then we

resubmitted the edited version. We waited for about a week, and it was

approved. It was approved before the final list of films selected for the

Cannes film festival was released, otherwise it wouldn’t have complied

with regulations.

 

Regarding the violence, they asked me if I could take out some of the

violent scenes, and I wrote back to them saying this is the point of the

movie. If I take them out, then I don’t know what we’re discussing [in the

film]. They had suggestions, and then they had things I had to do. Like in

the scene where they have the welcome ceremony at the airport, there was a

reference to something about harmony and they said I had to take this out.

I thought this was no loss to my film, so it wasn’t a problem.

 

Q. You don’t know who these censors are.

 

A. I do know some of the censors, because some of them are professors or

movie critics. Most I don’t know.

 

Q. A lot of people criticize [the writer] Yu Hua for being too close to

reality and everyday events. If you were criticized in this way, how would

you respond?

 

A. When I make a film, I have things I want to say. I think the way films

in China reflect current reality is too slow. In writing, artists and not

just journalists should record life. Contemporary people should film

contemporary stories. Contemporary people should write about contemporary

events. I think this is a very fundamental responsibility. Before, as we

were preparing to make a Qing Dynasty martial arts film, these other

stories moved me so much that I thought we should tell these stories

first. I’ve always wanted to be a storyteller whose work parallels

reality. That doesn’t necessarily mean you have to be very distant [in

time] in order to tell the story.

 

There are several types of films. There are films with stories that are

right in front of you, and you film them. And there is a type that is very

removed from the subject. For example, if we were to make a movie about

1949, we would be very removed from it. It’s also a good kind of movie.

But what China lacks today is films about 1949 made in 1949, films made

about the Cultural Revolution made during the Cultural Revolution, and

films about June 4 [the suppression of demonstrations in Tiananmen Square

in 1989] made during June 4. There needs to be an immediate reflection on

the moment. This is what’s missing.